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  • Batman vs Superman

    @Snake Explain why

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    • ^Bloated, incoherent and pretentious screenplay.
      "Which is better, eternal happiness or a ham sandwich? It would appear that eternal happiness is better, but this is really not so! After all, nothing is better than eternal happiness, and a ham sandwich is certainly better than nothing. Therefore a ham sandwich is better than eternal happiness."

      - Raymond M. Smullyan

      Comment


      • ^What is??

        Comment


        • ^BvS' screenplay. As in, the story.
          "Which is better, eternal happiness or a ham sandwich? It would appear that eternal happiness is better, but this is really not so! After all, nothing is better than eternal happiness, and a ham sandwich is certainly better than nothing. Therefore a ham sandwich is better than eternal happiness."

          - Raymond M. Smullyan

          Comment


          • And BvS is????? It may be obvious too you, but not me, obviously, since I've now asked a third time


            Edit: Ah I see now Maya edited her reply and answered for you.
            Last edited by The Rose; 03-28-2016, 03:23 AM.

            Comment


            • I'll go and see it tomorrow, and I hope you're wrong, Snake. But I think I'm less of a "conaisseur" of superhero products than you, so I don't have many thoughts of it yet.

              Anyhow, like for every movie, I'll go and see it without many thoughts or expectations in advance. That's how anyone should go watch any movie, I guess... More than half of the negative comments you read about films and albums is that it didn't live up to the expectations. An aspect that seems legit to many but for me says more about the person than the product.
              Dort wo der Horizont
              Sich mit dem Meer verbindet
              Dort wollt' ich auf dich warten
              Auf das du mich dort findest

              Comment


              • I will watch man of Steel before going to the cinema for BvS.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Waidmann View Post
                  I'll go and see it tomorrow, and I hope you're wrong, Snake. But I think I'm less of a "conaisseur" of superhero products than you, so I don't have many thoughts of it yet.

                  Anyhow, like for every movie, I'll go and see it without many thoughts or expectations in advance. That's how anyone should go watch any movie, I guess... More than half of the negative comments you read about films and albums is that it didn't live up to the expectations. An aspect that seems legit to many but for me says more about the person than the product.
                  Even disregarding any pre-concieved notions about what Batman and Superman should be/do, the screenplay is still a mess. You might like the movie for the collection of scenes and visual effects (which for the sake of fairness, are excellent), but not because of the story or dialogue. And trust me, I had not high expectations for this movie, only hope that would able to deliver on the story (which is exactly what completely failed)

                  Originally posted by Maya View Post
                  I will watch man of Steel before going to the cinema for BvS.
                  Man of Steel is a masterpiece compared to BvS, but like I hinted to Waidmann, it requires you do abandon any notion about what Superman should be or do.
                  Last edited by Snake; 03-28-2016, 04:51 PM.
                  "Which is better, eternal happiness or a ham sandwich? It would appear that eternal happiness is better, but this is really not so! After all, nothing is better than eternal happiness, and a ham sandwich is certainly better than nothing. Therefore a ham sandwich is better than eternal happiness."

                  - Raymond M. Smullyan

                  Comment


                  • ^It took some time before I really wanted to say something about "Batman v Superman", since I usually want to think about a film for a while before I state my opinion. I watched the film more than once this week, and I think I came to the conclusion that it IS a heavily flawed film, but I still liked it. I found a review from newspaper, which I can for the most part agree with. In short: Good effects, music ,action and a VERY good (maybe best) Batman. On the other hand, over-the-top performance by Eisenberg as Lex Luthor, very weird and quick transitions between scenes (it doesn't flow very well) and a very hard-to-follow 3rd act.

                    Not so long ago I watched an interview with screenwriter Max Landis. According to him, criticising the script of a movie is a risky thing to do. A screenwriter can write a fantastic script, yet the story of a movie can still be horrible due to the fact that the director changed/left-out the best parts of the script, and edited out important scenes. Because of this, I do agree with Snake that the story is the main problem, yet I hesitate to blame the writers. Instead I might blame Snyder.

                    It has been announced that a 3 hour long R-rated cut of the film will be released for home-entertaiment. I'm interested how this version will look, yet I doubt it will be a big improvment.

                    Either way, I would still recommend the film.
                    Last edited by Chrisss Nofff; 03-28-2016, 05:16 PM.

                    Comment


                    • ^If the extra 30 minutes of the R-Rated cut adds connective tissue that makes the story more coherent and fills in plotholes, than yeah, it might be worth to check it out. As for who is to blame for the botched story, it is ultimately the director's fault, because even if the screeenwriters fucked up, he could and should demand a re-write.

                      Speaking about Max Landis, here it is his take on the film (beware of big, nasty spoilers):

                      "Which is better, eternal happiness or a ham sandwich? It would appear that eternal happiness is better, but this is really not so! After all, nothing is better than eternal happiness, and a ham sandwich is certainly better than nothing. Therefore a ham sandwich is better than eternal happiness."

                      - Raymond M. Smullyan

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Maya View Post
                        I will watch man of Steel before going to the cinema for BvS.
                        Just did that , but I don't think it will be neccessary. For me, it was ok.
                        Dort wo der Horizont
                        Sich mit dem Meer verbindet
                        Dort wollt' ich auf dich warten
                        Auf das du mich dort findest

                        Comment


                        • ^Max Landis is VERY passionate about Superman, so I can understand why he has very strong opinions about this movie.


                          ++++++++++++Spoilers+++++++++++++++Spoilers++++++++++++++++++Spoilers

                          One complaint which I don't really understand, is when people complain that this movie is potraying Batman the wrong way, because he kills.
                          When it comes to Batman and the subject of killing, it really depends on which interpretation if the character you look at. For some reason there is this weird pop-culture myth that only the alternate "Earth 2"-Batman has ever killed in the comics. This is completely wrong, there are many instances of Batman killing outside of "Earth 2".

                          That being said, many recent portrails of Batman have used the "never kill"-moral as a story element in which some villain forces Batman into a situation, were he either way will be responisble for someone dying ("The Dark Knight" or the "Arkham"-games).



                          As this video below confirmes, even the Nolan-Batman has killed in the movies.
                          ++++++++++++Spoilers+++++++++++++++Spoilers++++++++++++++++++Spoilers
                          Last edited by Chrisss Nofff; 03-29-2016, 07:03 PM.

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                          • ^Speaking of extended cut, Warner Bros. already released a deleted scene.

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                            • Here it is a spoiler-full review that I completely agree with:

                              "Which is better, eternal happiness or a ham sandwich? It would appear that eternal happiness is better, but this is really not so! After all, nothing is better than eternal happiness, and a ham sandwich is certainly better than nothing. Therefore a ham sandwich is better than eternal happiness."

                              - Raymond M. Smullyan

                              Comment


                              • ^ I was pretty excited for the RLM review of this film, because I knew these guys had very strong opinions regarding "Man of Steel". While I disagree with their final verdict on the film, I do agree that the constant "blowing up cities"-climax in superhero movies is getting ridiculous. Both Avengers movies, Iron Man 2 + 3, Man of Steel, The Dark Knight Rises and many more, all end with gigantic battles in a city, or urban location. Now I do like all the movies I just mentioned, and I think their action scenes are good, yet some variation would be nice.

                                Therefore, I am most of all looking forward to a Ben Affleck-Batman movie. I feel the studio trusts Affleck enough to let him make a more "calm" film, without demanding at least 25 minutes of complete destruction.

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